Proposed Changes: Multiple Electrum Potion Drinks, Account Timeouts
October 12th, 2009 by Lyle MaeterlinckWe are considering the following changes to the Bloodlines game, and we wanted to open this up to comment from players. Recently, the most common complaint that we’ve been getting is that someone’s soul is being held hostage, or by someone who doesn’t log into SL anymore (and has the infinity amulet), and the person has already drank Electrum. These are the dead ends in the game that we created the Electrum potion to clear up, so that no matter what, there was always a last-resort way to move your soul. After release, we got a lot of compliments on the potion from people who could finally move their soul, and we got a lot of complaints about it from people who didn’t want to let certain souls go. Also, at the time, we were also accused of only releasing the potion so we could make more money, which is not the case. We made the potion expensive as a deterrent to it’s use, so that players would try to negotiate for souls and move them using the soul reaper instead of just buying the potion. A big part of the game is negotiating and making deals with other players. In an attempt to try to satisfy everyone (which we have found to be difficult), we made it so that the Electrum potion could only be used once, ever. After that, you might reach a dead end.
Now we are seeing a lot of people who have drank the Electrum potion some time in the last year, and now the person who has their soul isn’t around anymore, or the person who got them to drink the Electrum had them drink it so that they could never move their soul again. So, we have reached new dead ends in the game, and we need to do something in order to open them up. The first change we are considering is an account expiration if it isn’t used. Right now, if you don’t have an amulet, the Curse will eventually take all of your Blood, and your souls will go to the abyss. But, if you have the amulet, and you never log in again, all of your souls will just sit there forever.
These are the two changes we are considering:
- If an account hasn’t drank blood in the previous 90 days, even if they have an infinity amulet, they will be drained of blood and destroyed, sending souls to the abyss. This doesn’t mean that the account would be closed, they could always log back in and drink blood to become a vampire again, but their souls would be sent to the Abyss and freed into the game again.
- The permanent one-drink limit on the Electrum potion could be lifted. We could impose an additional limit, such as it can only be drank once every X number of months/weeks/days.
Please feel free to comment on the above changes in the comments string of this blog post, or in any of the Bloodlines groups in-world. If you’d like to send us your thoughts privately, feel free to send an IM or a notecard to Lyle Maeterlinck or Mars Bracken in world.
October 12th, 2009 at 7:42 pm
better idea, since you can change liege at any time, if someone has been 100% off the system for 90 days, at that time give the option to move your soul.. as in if they do not have the hud on for 90 days, give the option in the hud to move the soul. But a purchase made under clearly defined terms that this is forever, and a significant one at that being $30 USD at the going exchange rate, or more then what people pay for 3 months in second life, needs to be protected…
October 12th, 2009 at 8:09 pm
Multiple Electrums will solve the problem without screwing players who may have RL problems – im against any change to the amulet.
Electrum – let the inactive souls end up with the inactive lieges…..
October 12th, 2009 at 8:14 pm
I strongly oppose to number #1. What is the point of buying a expensive forever amulet, and I spent a considerable amount buying to myself and to some minions, if it will not be a forever amulet?
I am favorable to number #2
October 12th, 2009 at 8:27 pm
I can imagine that all the shoppers from SoulMart are shaking in their boots right now with news of these proposed changes regarding the amulet. While I do find that quite amusing, I sincerely do not agree with changing what the Infinity Amulet stands for. For the vampires out there that have taken time to hunt and worked hard for each soul and in some cases even purchased the hud for that person I feel this option is an insult. When you purchase something you expect it to do what it says on the can. Well in this case, we were all told that it would protect our soul count. In situations where something does not do what it states even within a game I think this leaves Bloodlines open to many legal avenues that will not be beneficial to the game or the people playing it. Real money was spent on these purchases and I think a lot of hands will be reaching out for refunds if this goes ahead.
As for the electrum proposition.. thumbs up! I talk to people on a daily basis that have their souls trapped somewhere they don’t want them to be. A time limitation on the electrum sounds superb. To be only able to use it once in a lifetime is very limiting especially considering how many people sometimes get married on sl (some as often as once a week! – they must love wedding cake) and the plethera of ex partners refusing to give up souls is enormous. So yes, make it multiple use, but either raise the price, or do it by time limit.
Nikita Mortenwold
Queen of Golgotha
October 12th, 2009 at 8:34 pm
As Para mentioned, let it be a loyalty lesson for those who’re able to liege to someone every 2 seconds and are stupid enough to offer their own souls so quickly…
I don’t mind the second option, just don’t let the player with the Amulet lose all of their souls, those who do want to be set free could request that from bloodlines..
*shakes her head* those Amulets weren’t freeeee u know ~_~
October 13th, 2009 at 12:56 am
I dont have an infinity amulet but i know many who do and i think option #1 is totally unfair and should not be done. My soul is currently with a liege who was banned and her account deleted from SL and she has an infinity amulet, so it sucks to be me. If changes are needed then #2 is the best option.
October 13th, 2009 at 5:20 am
People spent money in good faith for those amulets. It’s unfair, to put it mildly, to change the rules and the game in such a radical way. Am totally against proposal #1.
I’m ambivalent about electrum potion, however will go with the majority and say free up the use of the potion. Agree with #2.
Dotty Dotson
Treasured Clan
October 13th, 2009 at 7:46 am
As opposed to changing the Amulet, perhaps Destroyed Vampires souls who don’t log in for X amount of days can be returned to the Abyss. Soul collectors won’t like it much, but if a soul collector is holding or has lieged to them a bunch of destroyed vamps who are inactive, the only thing they are protecting is their soul count. They aren’t working with the people to get them active, they are only trading them when someone using Electrum is directing their soul to the collector and they are forced to trade a soul back.
Perhaps someone could put up a MM board for destroyed souls who are inactive for months at a time, in a vamp club. That would save the people who are trying to collect souls for no other reason than the numbers a lot of trouble.
October 13th, 2009 at 7:54 am
The option of the amulet is kind of insult to my intelligence or a joke ?? FOREVER means forever no 3 months. in my personal case i can’t log in to SL since 1.5 months by some situations in rl, and maybe for the next month. that’s mean i will lost all my souls?? what happen if i am the head of my clan?? the clan just be erased??
i spent (and many friends) 7999 lindens to be protected forever no for a period of time. please consider thing this twice before to make the forever a 3 months protection amulet. if this happen all the have a FOREVER amulet will recibe a refound for degrading it ?
The elctrum potion optin is good. it could work more than one time if the one that have the souls is not conected for a time(3,6 months)
Hekk Beverly
Eztli Calli Clan
October 13th, 2009 at 8:13 am
I strongly oppose changing the rules on the amulet. Most people get it in case RL intervenes and they are unable to log on for long periods of time. Medical issues can arise at any time, for example.
That said I see no problem with changing the procedure for the electrum. I would think 6 months would be fair.
October 13th, 2009 at 8:55 am
Definitely opposed to Option #1…people payed 8000L for the amulets, knowing that sometimes RL does take you out of the game for an indeterminate period of time (military service, illness, tragedy). Option #2 is the better of the 2, if it were, say, restricted to only using electrum once every 6 months or something.
October 13th, 2009 at 2:36 pm
Forgive me for reposting please… but as we hotly discuss this subject in the various groups my thoughts on this have matured. Here is my final opinion on this matter:
I like both new proposed changes actually.. one without the other would still leave loopholes.
Regarding electrim:
If the electrim had a re-use timeout of 6 months.. it would finally provide an end to a dead end to those who need it, no matter how evil the soul holder is. The electrim provides for a trade for that soul… an even trade of a dead soul for a soul who no longer respects or wants to be involved with that liege. This is fair… and to have it otherwise is unfair to no one but the person who feels they have been wronged and needs to leave that leige.
The amulet is a stickier problem. I don’t think upon reading the specs on the amulet that it can now be changed to require one to “drink” every 90 days. Having an amulet however doesnt mean you can walk away from the game and hurt those under you. The problems here are with players who decide to put souls on inactve alts and then cancel the accounts, wear garlic or do other tricks to make it impossible to take the souls away. I do not like the arguement that since one spends the money on an amulet, that they forever, active or not, control the souls and maintain their status in the bloodlines games, no matter what they do. This is a game, and there must be rules. Dead people and cancelled accounts have no business being part of the leadership in this game. Yes, there is the argument that the Amulet is advertised as a “forever” amulet and you should never need to drink again. Clearly upon reading the instructions that come with the Amulet, all it is advertised to do is “protect you from the curse”. It clearly states that you can still be destroyed if you are not careful. As such, it works perfectly, but I do not believe that it was ever looked at as a vehicle to hold massive numbers of souls till the end of time, even after you have left the game. I see no problem at all in requiring an active soul holder to log into the game at least every 3-6 months in order to keep their soul count or in other words, their status within the bloodlines game, intact. If you are in a situation where medically you can not get to the game, a family member or friend could help if it was important enough to you. Deployed personell and vacationers could do the same, or give their active souls to someone to safeguard and nurture while they were gone.
Lastly, for those demanding that if these changes are made, they wish their money back for the amulet. From the Amulet TOS I quote, “Liquid Designs has the right at any time for any reason or no reason to change and/or eliminate any aspect(s) of the Service as it sees fit in its sole discretion.” This is pretty clear, and i suggest you read your TOS because they also have covered very carefully their refusal to refund any part of the money spent on these products. I would suggest to those of you threatening to quit or demand your money back if they do this to calm down… realize that these rules are being proposed to change to make the game better, not to get more money out of you… and if you really want to quit, please send your captured souls to me so I can take good care of them.
Fulvia Milena, Queen of the Purebloodz Clan
October 13th, 2009 at 2:41 pm
Bad idea. Those of us who invested in the amulet that do play the game should not be penalized for others. Make it part of the HUD checking in process. If user has lost interest in Bloodlnes they dont wear hud anymore. Same goes if they never log into SL they never check in with the hud.
October 13th, 2009 at 5:18 pm
“Dead people and cancelled accounts have no business being part of the leadership in this game.”
“Lastly, for those demanding that if these changes are made, they wish their money back for the amulet. From the Amulet TOS I quote”
Fulvia Milena, Queen of the Purebloodz Clan
I would like to comment on the aforementioned quotes made by Fulvia Milena. I would have cut and pasted and commented on the entire text but unlike some I feel no need for extremely long comments to gain the attention of others.
The comments are in poor taste as no consideration is given to the player, and by players I mean more than a cartoon avatar their are real people behind these avatars. If some lose their lives in defense of our country or just have an accident on their way home they should be acknowledged respectfully. I would just like to apologize on behalf of Fulvia Milena for the comment regarding the dead. If “the game” was designed as such and friends memorialize persons in such a way, so bet it.
Regarding the second comment regarding “Liquid Designs Rights,” yes we all see the pop ups and are required to acknowledge their rights (post purchase I might add) Liquid Designs are free to make whatever changes they desire. I would like to thank Liquid Designs for allowing us the moment to post our opinions. In the end they will make the final decision regarding the rules. However, I say again there are real people behind these avatars and it is they who will decide if they chose to continue playing or not.
Thank you Fulvia Milena for your comments, I’m sure whomever you are trying to please, be it Liquid Designs or yourself, none the less I am sure you have gained that attention you so clearly desired.
Ares, God of War
October 13th, 2009 at 7:49 pm
je ne cautionne pas du tout votre raisonnement vis a vis de l amulette car nous ancien vampire avons depenser 7999ls pour une amulette INFINIE et non pas pour 90 jours donc il n y a aucune raison qu on en patissent.De plus changer les regles d un roleplay en court de roleplay vous avez vu ca ou ??? rajouter des item est tout a fait normal mais changer l utilisation des item deja existant est totalement
anti-roleplay.Donc je m oppose fortement a tous vos changements evoqués ci dessus car a ce moment la le jeu en est totalement modifié ainsi que les regles .
merci
October 13th, 2009 at 10:25 pm
I’ve noticed Fulvia Milena, Queen of the Purebloodz Clan takes pride on commenting on others comments. It would be best not to be so self absorbed (as observed by posting titles), and just make ones point.
Ditto on the following comment posted by Ares, “Liquid Designs are free to make whatever changes they desire. I would like to thank Liquid Designs for allowing us a moment to post our opinions. In the end they will make the final decision regarding the rules. However, I say again there are real people behind these avatars, and it is they who will decide if they chose to continue playing or not.”
October 14th, 2009 at 7:03 am
I am opposed proposal number 1 it is a bad idea, I spent 30 dollars rl money on the forever protection,(hence the word forever) so I wouldn’t have to worry about that. I know that if my computer broke and it cost alot of money it might take me a few months to get back on. Then all my hard work would be in the abyss. I would definitely want a refund.
Proposal #2 is okay if it has a cap on it. When you take the electrum potion you get a pretty clear warning, this is permanent. I know that a lot of these issues involve giving your soul to a boyfriend/girlfriend, then breaking up. Which is no ones business, but you can’t complain about the system after.
October 14th, 2009 at 10:05 am
BL is looking for a simple solution that will be of good to all players. Their intention I’m sure isn’t to have people quit, or be upset.
The issues to the problem was stated once you drink the Electrum you run into a dead end with the soul keeper whether it be “the person who has their soul isn’t around anymore, or the person who got them to drink the Electrum had them drink it so that they could never move their soul again [or whatever the reason may be for drinking the Electrum].
Again, having the Electrum become available for drinking after 3 months would be reasonable, in my opinion. 6 months seems a bit long.
Regarding Fulvia Milena’s comment: “I see no problem at all in requiring an active soul holder to log into the game at least every 3-6 months in order to keep their soul count or in other words…..If you are in a situation where medically you can not get to the game, a family member or friend could help if it was important enough to you.” Seriously? RL comes before SL, no exceptions. If I cannot log on, for whatever reason (seriously ill, deceased, vacation)…the last thing I will be worried about is making sure I tell a close friend/family member my SL account info. so they can figure out a way to log on and drink blood for me. Expecting someone to do so in such conditions is ludicrous.
Regardless of the reason why someone may not log onto SL for a while is irrelevant. As many have said, many things can come up/happen, or just become uninterested. This doesn’t mean that that person should be punished for doing so. Simply make it to where a liege can retrieve a soul in lifting the drink limit.
October 14th, 2009 at 11:24 am
I understand that the Amulet is only to keep you from being Destroyed via the Curse….that one could still become Destroyed by being bitten or what have you. I have no issue with the Amulet being left as is; it IS about $30 dollars of real money. But when it comes to the Electrum? Keep it 999L and let people use it as often as they want to, but without the soul trade being required.
If people who are holding all those souls started dropping in BL levels because they aren’t actually tending to their personal line….maybe the people who are in their line would be more successful? And hey, I met a guy today who creates av’s with souls and a BL HUD for 750 per, 7000 for 10 or 13,500 for 20 and gives you the password. Its a nice thing for those who are only worried about their soul count. I applaud what BL just did with limiting clan/horde numbers to active (thus non-destroyed) vampires. It helps keep things a little bit more honest.
As to not having access to the Net? I am amazed at the the number of people who don’t have friends with computers or who only have one in the space they live in. Logging in is truly no stress on anyone.
October 14th, 2009 at 11:47 am
I agree that something should be done about the souls that are locked up with another and that person no longer comes to SL. Heaven forbid if I were to die in RL, my minions would go on and I would want them to and I don’t think they should have to be forced to buy the potion to move there soul as I am no longer here to do it. I agree it should be based off of the HUD and that when you log in it gets tracked that way rather then when you feed. I have the amulet for a reason, I am to busy running my clan and my business to go out there and hunt all the time, that’s why I got it.
As for the time frame for the souls to go to the abyss, it should be no less then 90 days but no more then 180 days. With the way the world is now, there are computers everywhere so even in the event you lose your internet or the computer totally blows up, there is still a way to get logged on. But the log on should be in SL not a check in here at the BL site. As for those that are going to be gone for a long time, like those in the military, they need to make arrangements for someone else to take care of there AV while they are away.
October 14th, 2009 at 12:50 pm
I’d like to comment on Fulvia’s highlighting of Bloodlines TOS :
“From the Amulet TOS I quote, “Liquid Designs has the right at any time for any reason or no reason to change and/or eliminate any aspect(s) of the Service as it sees fit in its sole discretion.” This is pretty clear, and i suggest you read your TOS because they also have covered very carefully their refusal to refund any part of the money spent on these products.”
While I can quite understand changing the game to make it more interesting and changing FUTURE products, irregardless of this small print, I’d also like to draw your attention to the instructions of the actual product and what it says it does and will do at the time of our purchase.
“WEARING YOUR AMULET
Included in the box is your Amulet attachment.
To attach your Amulet, simply right-click and choose “wear”.
Once your Amulet is rezzed or attached for the first time, it will protect you from the Bloodlines vampire Curse, permanently.”
It’s also called the “INFINITY Amulet”
So yes I can understand why people are upset as people paid real money for a product, and whether that be in SL or RL if something doesn’t do what it is supposed to do I’m sure Trading Standards and other organisations would be only too happy to investigate.
By all means if Bloodlines wants to change what future purchases do that is their prerogative but just as Fulvia says people should think carefully about demanding money back, I think just as much caution aught to be applied to limiting a service that people bought for a specific reason… to protect them PERMANENTLY… not PERMANENTLY until we change the rules.
December 13th, 2009 at 10:02 am
k, I like option #2, I don’t appreciate other players holding souls for ransom OR hostage. When someone ask to leave them alone, ok, well if you have someones soul and they want it back or give it to someone THAT will take care of it. Do you think they should give them the soul to that person that wants it.
Someone *name will not be used* has told someone that I know to leave them alone, well all they want is their soul back so it can be giving to another that wants it and knows they will take great care of it. They make it noted they want real US $$ to be paid back to them then they will give the soul back, maybe.
So I like option #2, so many mins, so on, or can we get a new bottle of the Electrum Potion & don’t mess that person that obviously wants to be left alone but stills contacts them for money they gave them in real life.
I understand the potion is expensive and only can be used once, but it doesn’t take to long to know there will be pple holding souls hostage or for ransom real life money to be paid back to them. Knowing this problem will arrise at some point, I feel there should be a second chance version of the Electrum Potion for pple that feel their souls are just being held for the stupidest reasons. Like a reversal of the potion that makes it that they never used the potion at all.
I know the idea is not great but it will help out with the problems that will arrise soon again later times.
Make the potion less expensive for the second chance, but this is my thought.